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OK, purely for everyone's information, here's information on what is covered in your Intellectual Property, what rights you have and for how long...
First Copyright:
Copyright covers works of original authorship fixed in a TANGIBLE MEDIUM of expression and includes things like literary works, musical works, dramatic works, pantomimes, choreographed works, pictorial works, graphic works, sculptural works, motion pictures, audiovisual works, sound recordings, architectural works.
Your rights under copyright:
-to reproduce copies of your work
-to create derivative works
-publicly distribute copies of work
-publicly display works
-publicly perform works
-digitally transmit sound recordings
Copyright is assigned to a piece of work AS SOON AS THE WORK IS FIXED IN A TANGIBLE MEDIUM OF EXPRESSION. If I write on a piece of paper, as soon as my pen leaves that page, I have copyright protection on it. However, if you ever want to file a suit of copyright infringement, you must FIRST register your copyright with the copyright office (cheap [~$20 I think] and easy) but if you do so before infringment, it gives a date on which to back your claim.
Copyright lasts for the life of the author plus 70 years or 95 years from publication for corporate works.
There are limitations on the rights such as fair use (for example, using part of the work not the whole), special rights for libraries and archives, nonprofit performances, first sale doctrine, adaptations of computer programs etc (I'll go into this more if there's interest but leave it here for now)
So what does all this mean for our community? Well, generally our fire tools are not covered by copyright. They've been around for way too long to claim copyright. Some of the decorative elements could have copyright protection (like Tabasco's eating torches) but even then, copyright offers very little protection in that a small variation in a new piece would make it unique and hence not copyright infringement, ie there's a low standard of orginality to meet in copyright. Our choreographies are definitely copyrightable (you don't need to record it to have copyright on your choreography - but you would to register your copyright!) and again, there's a low standard of originality so would be hard to claim infringment unless it's step by step or EXTREMLEY similar.
I'll dabble into Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret in subsequent posts..
First Copyright:
Copyright covers works of original authorship fixed in a TANGIBLE MEDIUM of expression and includes things like literary works, musical works, dramatic works, pantomimes, choreographed works, pictorial works, graphic works, sculptural works, motion pictures, audiovisual works, sound recordings, architectural works.
Your rights under copyright:
-to reproduce copies of your work
-to create derivative works
-publicly distribute copies of work
-publicly display works
-publicly perform works
-digitally transmit sound recordings
Copyright is assigned to a piece of work AS SOON AS THE WORK IS FIXED IN A TANGIBLE MEDIUM OF EXPRESSION. If I write on a piece of paper, as soon as my pen leaves that page, I have copyright protection on it. However, if you ever want to file a suit of copyright infringement, you must FIRST register your copyright with the copyright office (cheap [~$20 I think] and easy) but if you do so before infringment, it gives a date on which to back your claim.
Copyright lasts for the life of the author plus 70 years or 95 years from publication for corporate works.
There are limitations on the rights such as fair use (for example, using part of the work not the whole), special rights for libraries and archives, nonprofit performances, first sale doctrine, adaptations of computer programs etc (I'll go into this more if there's interest but leave it here for now)
So what does all this mean for our community? Well, generally our fire tools are not covered by copyright. They've been around for way too long to claim copyright. Some of the decorative elements could have copyright protection (like Tabasco's eating torches) but even then, copyright offers very little protection in that a small variation in a new piece would make it unique and hence not copyright infringement, ie there's a low standard of orginality to meet in copyright. Our choreographies are definitely copyrightable (you don't need to record it to have copyright on your choreography - but you would to register your copyright!) and again, there's a low standard of originality so would be hard to claim infringment unless it's step by step or EXTREMLEY similar.
I'll dabble into Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret in subsequent posts..
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Thu, February 19, 2004 - 9:52 PMTalia
Great post I wish I had run into you before I spent all that money on a lawyer :::::::::laughs::::::::::
Your info matchs what I was told and to add a little to your post from my own experience Fire tools can hold a copyrite as you said Tabasco's eating torches ( which i will say are a work of art great job man) are just that "art" and cant be reproduced without his consent.even know we may not invent a fire tool if our design of a tool is original and we have proof of the date it was made the artist has rights to its design.
Patents these are touchy and costly and very hard to protect unless you have the funds for court battles and file fees . with fire tools which I will add most of them no one holds any patent on.It is a pretty much who ever files 1st kind of deal.and even then if you hold a patent on something all someone has to do is alter your design by a certain % (I think 10%) and they have broke your rights.What you have to do is Patent "how it is built" and you may have to get more than one patent to protect yourself.I will use my firewhips for example
I hold 3 Patents on the construction of them all 3 for a different design . True I did not invent the bull whip nor did I make the 1st fire whip But I did design and make the 1st fire whip using my design of fire proof materials and with the patent written in the way it is that is what is protected.We pretty much copied the patent filing used by Flowmaster muffers they had great Success protecting their product. To file this type of Patent is about 300 bucks per patent plus a lawyer(or slip Talia some free fire tools::::laughs::: )and that only covers you in the us for an international Patent you are looking at 5 times that.No to even think about the expense of enforcing a international patent
I think in the fire industry patents are kind of like door locks they only keep the honest people honest.If someone wants to make your stuff bad enough they will find a way.
For the record I do just that for a living in my 9 to 5 job
I take Factory outboard motor marine parts.And make auto cad redesigns of them.Altering them just enough to were the company I work for can have them reproduced in Taiwan.
I am no lawyer or ex-spurt on this topic this is just my experience. I hope it helps someone . -
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Thu, February 19, 2004 - 11:14 PMI can't speak to the legal aspects of patent protection, but I can talk about it from a business perspective. I think there are plenty of ways for you to protect your livlihood other than patents. The best thing to do is simply be the best. If you make the best tools, people will respect your work, and if you put on a great show, you will be in demand.
You can also use market power or influence to protect yourself... While no one has enough power to push others around in terms of fire tools and performance, we do live in a world of relationships. Think of it in terms of bands. There are tons of decent bar bands around - why do the same ones get gigs over and over? Because they've built relationships with bars and promoters, and they've developed an audience. They also have to be good enough to entertain that audience over and over -- improving their shows over time, etc. In other words, build your reputation!
Yeah, it's great if you can be the only fire performer with tool X... but that's not the only thing you've got going for you. You've got the fact that you're reliable, that you know how to deal with the fire department, maybe that you have insurance... and basically you're a known quantity, and you've got some sort of established relationship or some way of assuring the promoter that you're good.
You can also do a little bit of what we marketing geeks call Branding. (No, not the body art... branding like Pepsi branding) I'm reluctant to say too much, because it's my opinion that people usually spend too much on branding... but basically make a name for yourself, and make sure people know who you are! If you've got enough fans, start an email list to tell them about gigs... basically, if you can bring your own fans to a show, a promoter's going to like that.
Anyhow, I guess what I'm saying is... don't depend on legal protections -- it's too costly to even consider suing someone anyhow. Build up other reasons that you're the one to get hired. Put on a good show! Be professional and honor the relationships that you've developed with promoters. Build a fan base!
Okay, maybe I'm thinking too much. -
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Fri, February 20, 2004 - 1:34 PMRoger, you bring up a great point with branding...I think that is one of the most useful tools that we have power over. I can walk into a fire show in Seattle and even if the performers were all people I didn't know, I would be able to recognize if it was Ignis Devoco, or Pyrosutra, or Cirque de Flambé, or the Cabiri...there are more troupes than that in Seattle but those in particular have a certain look, style & feel to their shows that make them stand out as unique...If you've seen one of them before, you will know when you are seeing them again. Even if you gave them all the exact same tools & time frame, they would each create their own distinctive "brand" of show.
This does take effort from the troupe or performer but with the growth of our medium I feel that branding is an integral part of creating a name for yourself. -
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Thu, February 26, 2004 - 9:49 AMWow! Such a wonderful conversation!
Okay...Intellectual Property is concidered to be anything performed, but not always written, and can also be video documented. The date and times have to be recorded on the bottom of the footage, but this helps for those spontaneous creation moments we all have, and is admissable in court. I found this out when a, get this one, producer I worked for claimed to own my material because in his contract it said that all intellectual property was covered by copyright, and he meant his!
In many areas what we are really battling is "spontaneous creation", when two artists claim that they created the same thing at the same time in two different places, with minute variations. It has happened, alot, and if it can not be compromised on then it comes down to who said or did it first, which with copyright is a pain because it covers complete works, not ideas or even items which are similar (how many musicians have gotten away with having something "similar" but so close to the real thing it went to court?). This happened to a friend of mine, and neither won the suit. It was concidered, I think she called it, spontaneous creative genius, and both their copyrights stood on something very nearly identical. I see it as motivation to 1) unfortunately, not share more than the intermediates that everyone does or routines I could care less about and 2) keep on the top of my game. All aspects of performing, and indeed, creation, seem to be this way...or at least have been since my professional involvement 11+ years ago.
Trademark vs. Servicemark. They are an expensive investment to be sure. You have to do public searches which can be quite costly to make sure no one else has it. Trademark is for actual companies that produce items..Kellogg's, Proctor and Gamble, etc. They give you something tangable in exchange for money...or trade you. Riz and Tobasco could use Trademarks for their shops. Servicemarks are for those who provide a service, but not items. A plumber, a production company, an electrician...etc. Performers fall under this category. What it does is protect your name from being used by others on a national scale. A D.B.A. will do that on a local scale and an LLC or incorporation can do that on a state scale. This way others can't really go around and trash your rep. by using your name. However, I have not seen a performer with a Servicemark (this little r in the circle, like the tm or c) but I do know many national production companies who have it. These both will also protect not only the name but the writing of it, the logo, etc. For example, Toy's R Us recently went after a mom-n-pop shop which did tires called Tires R Us with a backward "r", and won because of the similarities to their Trademark. However, Cirque Du Soliel went after several performance companies that use Cirque in their title and lost because the presentation was not similar nor was the overall title. Very nitpicky stuff we are dealing with.
I am still not sure how I feel about these. I looked into getting my production company servicemarked, and now that I am producing shows in the south, I think there is more of a need, but I am still debating.
And I wanted to speak for a moment on branding. I completely agree with Willow and Roger on the benefits, but let's not downplay the drawbacks as well. I have seen people who are unsafe and slipshod performers who have talked such a good game that everyone thought they were wonderful. Marketting plays a huge part in branding, and if you never intend to perform in the same venue twice, then it is all good. (My example of this is the Suicide Girls current Burlesque Tour, which was not Burlesque at all and minimally entertaining. They have a brand that makes you think quality, so they pack the house and deliver substandard.) Reputation-Branding is huge, but as a part of marketting, not as a point of quality control or protection I feel. -
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Thu, February 26, 2004 - 3:27 PM"spontaneous creative genius"
love that
"My example of this is the Suicide Girls current Burlesque Tour, which was not Burlesque at all and minimally entertaining. They have a brand that makes you think quality, so they pack the house and deliver substandard."
Yikes!! I just sent my hubby out to buy tix for this on Friday... -
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Thu, February 26, 2004 - 4:30 PMWillow, They prance well and don't really do Burlesque. I know people who have seen them in 8 cities (including myself and my dance troupe, and Domba! dance troupe in Arizona) who have been sadly disappointed. My advice wear clothes you don't care about or stay well away from the stage. In many cities (including mine) they spray beer, chocolate syrup and reddi-whip all over the audience. There were alot of pissed people at our show. Also, unfortunately, they have two opening bands you have to sit through before their show even starts. If duct tape nipples and prancing girls in g-strings wiggling, not dancing, isn't your thing sell the tickets to someone else. But this is all my opinion. Take care! ~Pele -
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Thu, February 26, 2004 - 6:55 PM""""nipples and prancing girls in g-strings wiggling, not dancing""""
Willow I will buy the tickets :::::grins::::: sounds like my kind of show.
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Mon, March 1, 2004 - 1:29 PMSorry to veer off the topic again but Pele, you were oh so right. Although we didn't have the issue with our clothes getting dirty...we left halfway through the show. Thanks for the heads up...at least my expectations were low. This is a really great example of how branding *could* have been very helpful. Suicide Girls is getting to be a household word (depending on your house). If they had put on a good show, they would have sold out their dates. I saw bad reviews from all over the tour and everyone I know that likes Burlesque & saw this show were very disappointed. I have one word for them...actually, I have more than one word but this is just the first word...PASTIES!!!! so much cuter than electrical tape in that setting.
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Thu, February 26, 2004 - 7:35 PMPeople often mistakenly believe that if you think about marketing, you must not think as much about your product. That's not true at all! The quality of your product is more important than anything else... but at the same time, you have to let people know you exist!
The 4 P's of Marketing:
Product, Price, Place, and Promotion. You need to perform well in all 4 P's in order for you to succeed!
Roger
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Re: Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Trade Secret
Fri, February 27, 2004 - 10:27 AM"Intellectual Property is concidered to be anything performed, but not always written, and can also be video documented."
In the context of choreography, writings can be protected if they are in a form similar to notations- like dancers notations. In essence, a performance choreography can be copyrighted if it is in a fixed form as noted above. Fixation can include the notations(or something similar) and video. Bear in mind that video will only protect that particular performance. So if there are changes to the performance at another show- it must be documented. Geat discussion on this issue on one of the belly dance tribes- Too Much Drama To Dance- I, think.
I agree with the points on alternatives to litigation. Litigation is expensive and it is emotional. Think creatively on approaches to a problem. Also, I recommend alternative dispute resolution to my clients. Mediation is a great tool and can be used pre-lawsuit. Mediators come from all backgrounds- not just lawyers or ex-judges. Anway, my 2 cents.
I loved the creative patent on the fire whip- very smart!
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